Fighting Ships

A thread of 2 messages, 15 April 1990 to 16 April 1990, in the order they were sent.

#1221 Fighting Ships

I'd like to put my fairly moderate two cents on Fighting Ships.

First: you can't deny that a lot of work went into it.  Fifty plus ships,
quite well done, indicates that Marc Miller did indeed put effort into it.  I
like the idea of tracing the evolution of combat vessels over time, and some
of the comments are quite telling.

Secondly: it corrects a longstanding discrepancy between estimated imperiumwide
naval budgets [simple calculation, everyone ought to have done this a long time
ago] and depicted naval force levels.  The ships shown make naval fleets that
are bigger and more expensive by about the right amount to correct the
differences.

Third: despite the number of ships that are in it, it lacks depth in a lot of
ways.  We are asked that imperial naval development produced no more than three
ships in the same size range [BB, Cruiser, whatever...] per tech level...about
a hundred years.  That, and a total abandonment of previously designed fighting
starship designes...[Marc! Where'd my Tigress go!?!? :-) ].

Fourth: there are some production and design flaws.  A lot of typos, most
annoying to me being the appearance of a lot of spurious '300,00 tons is fuel
tankage for distribution.' lines, particularly irritating in 30kton Battle
Riders... :-)

Things like using spinal PA's can be forgiven; note that those are the 'light
battleships' not the mainline ones.  The armour factor violations...well, in
my humble opinion it's a) not the first time [check out 101 Vehicles, which was
approved] and b) a silly rule to start with.  now that mass _counts_, armour
is really its own penalty.

And a couple of observations...
	{SIGNIFICANT} almost ALL the main line ships have a Def DM of 7.  I
have a feeling that this means something.  The gaming that GDW does internally
must (speculation) have shown that this is the best balanced level.  Note also
that most of the ships have agility=0 to not exceed that level.  This is counter
to my personal intuition, and someone should ask inside GDW and try and see
if i read this right.

	{FOR NORMAL PLAYERS, PERHAPS MORE SIGNIFICANT}  the imperial navy is now
WAY out of reach when it comes to 'player resistance to/attacks on' naval
vessels.

*******************************************************************************
George William Herbert              JOAT For Hire: Anything, Anywhere: My Price
   UCB Naval Architecture undergrad: Engineering with a Bouyant Attitude :-)
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"Who?" the man managed.                    "Whip me, Beat Me, Make me use C..."
"The Rastafarian Navy," Case said,         ++++++++++ [email removed]       OR
"...and all we want is a jack into your    ========== [email removed] OR
custodial system." -neuromancer            """""""" [email removed]

#1222 Re: Fighting Ships

I don't have the book yet (local game store sold out - Grrr...), but I would
like to comment on one remark George made.

>{SIGNIFICANT} almost ALL the main line ships have a Def DM of 7.  I
>have a feeling that this means something.  The gaming that GDW does internally
>must (speculation) have shown that this is the best balanced level.  Note also
>that most of the ships have agility=0 to not exceed that level.  This
is counter
>to my personal intuition, and someone should ask inside GDW and try and see
>if i read this right.

The reason all the main line ships have a Def DM of 7 is because it is the best
practical for a large, heavily armored ship.
Def DM = 9	(best computer available at TL 15)
	-2	(size mod for ships 100,000 tons or more)
	+0	(agility)
	= 7

	The reason that the agility is 0 is due to the heavy armor.  Even though
mass doesn't affect manuver drive performance (handled, along with many other
tasks, by the manuver drive physics nullifier box), it still is used for
agility.  Thus
the heavy armor makes it prohibitively expensive to get any agility bonus.
Example:  A 100,000 ton ship with an armor factor 100 bonded superdense hull
would mass ~1.535 E7 tons just for the hull. In order to get agility 1,
it would require
*spare* power of  ~2.84 E6 MW = 158,000 kl of power plant (11.7% of the ship)
plus 1,024,000 kl for a 30-day fuel supply (75.8% of the ship if you
really want to try).
	Armor that heavy does have the advantage of making you immune to
everything except meson guns, as was noted in a previous post.
	I'm sure I will find other problems when I finally get the book. (I wish
these things had warranties)

>George William Herbert

					W. Dow Rieder

 	When the only tool you have is a hammer, all your problems
start to look like nails...