cold start launch

A thread of 5 messages, 5 October 1989 to 13 October 1989, in the order they were sent.

#596 cold start launch

RE: Paul Gazis

Your descriptions of different states of readiness seems to overlap some.
RESERVE implies that the powerplanet 'fusors' are running, but the description
does not match.

RESERVE- Fusors up, drives ready, ship pre-flighted and on internal  power.

LOW STANDBY- Engineering systems on line at low power, ship ready to  lift
after drives and fusors have been warmed up and pre-takeoff checklist  has been
completed.

In my mind, there should be the states:

DEAD         :  No energy being generated or used:
BATTERY POWER:  Battery power is available.  Doors, life support, lighting,
                controls may be turned on or off.  Computer will drain
                batteries within an hour if used.
BATTERY DIAG :  Normally a set of diagnostics are run on battery power before
                bringing up the main power plant.  Takes 5-15 minutes.
POWER CHARGE :  Charge the power plant in preperation to starting it.
                Can take minutes to hours depending on TL.
POWER START  :  Main fusion power plant is running at minimum capacity.  Full
                power is available within a moment.  Computer is available.
POWER DIAG   :  Normally a set of diagnostics are run to fully check the ship's
                systems.  Takes an hour or more.
MANEUVER WARM:  Apply power to the maneuver drives and ready for full power.
                Takes a moment.
GRAVITY START:  Ship's gravitics lift off the ship from the surface.
MANEUVER START: Ships's maneuver drives produce appropriate thrust at
                appropriate altitude.
JUMP DIAG    :  Diagnostics are run for the Jump Drive.
JUMP WARM    :  Minimum energy is applied to the Jump Drive.
JUMP DIAG    :  Diagnostics are run again for the Jump Drive.
JUMP START   :  The Jump Drive is energized, and the ship transfers to jump space.
JUMP MAINT   :  Jump Drive runs to maintain Jump.
JUMP STOP    :  Jump Drive is ??? to exit Jump.

most ships are kept at POWER STARTed state if they are going to be used within
the next month, or if there is crew aboard.  Naturally, the diagnostic steps
can be skipped.  The drives can each also be cold started with significant
chances of failure.

Jim Baranski
Tewksbury MA

#605 RE: cold start launch

[This came to [email removed], looks like it was meant for
[email removed].  Watch those automatic reply headers! -- James]

RE: Jim Baranski

>Your descriptions of different states of readiness seems to overlap some.
>RESERVE implies that the powerplanet 'fusors' are running, but the
>description does not match.

     Sigh, 'tis true.  I admit it.  I do not have my rules memorized and
was trying to reconstruct them off the top of my head while waiting for a
program to bomb.  I was partially sucessful.  The program did bomb.

>RESERVE- Fusors up, drives ready, ship pre-flighted and on internal power.

>LOW STANDBY- Engineering systems on line at low power, ship ready to
>lift after drives and fusors have been warmed up and pre-takeoff checklist
>has been completed.

     I knew that!  I knew that!  I was just testing to see if you were
paying attention.

>In my mind, there should be the states:
>[description of states follows]

     The heart of the matter.  Yes, you have chosen fine states.  They
are goodly states indeed.  I will be the first to admit that your states
are every bit as good as mine.  Maybe better.  However...
     Your states appear to be chosen on the basis of crew activities,
mine were chosen on the basis of power consumption and drive functionality.
Other possibilities exist as well (weapons functionality, avionics status,
opperational level of the Feel-O-Tron, etc.)  The particular choice of
opperational states would seem to depend upon the nature of the starcrew
subculture, the availability of Feel-O-Trons, and the whimsy of the GM.
A martial culture may only be concerned with the weapons.  A race of
hedonists may wait in line for the Feel-O-Tron.  Eight Worlds ships are
TERRIBLY fuel limited so fuel management becomes THE overriding issue.
     And oh yes I forgot.  Fuel consumption and power level also
determine the extent to which the ship is visible to passive sensors.
This has, at times, been a matter of supreme importance.

TECHNICAL NOTE:
     There are no GRAVITICS in the Eight Worlds universe.  Eight Worlds
spacecraft are propelled by reaction drives, the way the gods meant Man
to propel spacecraft.  No inertial compensation either.  Grunt snort.
     There are also no Feel-O-Trons in the Eight Worlds, to the dismay
of PCs who think that this would be an acceptible alternative to
inertial compensation.

Paul R. Gazis
Sunnyvale, CA

[email removed]           or
[email removed]                    or
something like that

#606 Re: cold start launch

About starships, airliners, and fighter planes:

Northrop claims that an F-20 can go from sitting on the runway with the pilot
drinking coffee to 20,000 feet and firing missiles at incoming enemy bombers in
less than a minute.  We can reasonably assume it takes about twice that long.
The MegaTraveller rules state that it takes 3d6 X 30 seconds to warm-start the
fusion plant on a parked starship or small craft, which works out to about 5
minutes.  If you add in safety checks like you're supposed to, you have to make
a Cautious task attempt, which means it takes twice as long, or 10 minutes.
Once we add in taxi and takeoff times, it appears that spacecraft in Traveller
take about as long to take off if they're following traffic control rules as
our airliners do.

Let's examine a typical Traveller case of a PC group in a hurry to take off.
Scout Susan Blaire is surveying a Tech Level 0 world.  She leaves her Type/S
Scout/Courier in "low fuel consumption park" mode as she plans to move on to
another continent the next day.  While outside her ship, she encounters natives
of the Ooga-Booga tribe (a minor race of humaniti).  While conversing with their
Grand High Poobah by use of her CLT, she rolls a fumble and manages to offend
His High Grumpiness.  Her attempt to patch things up (a hazardous, fateful
Liason test) results in a Destroyed mishap.  She decides to run for her life.

She manages to get back to her ship 2 1/2 minutes ahead of the pursuing savages.
Crash-starting her scout ship requires a Routine, Pilot, Dex, 30 sec.  Letting
TL 0 savages see a TL 15 scout ship is against Scout Service regulations, so
she decides to rush things a bit.  Her dexterity of 10 and her Pilot skill of 2
combine to give her a +4 DM on the task attempt.  Normally she would need a 7+
since this is a routine task, but since she's making a hasty attempt the
difficulty goes up one level, to an 11+.  She rolls a 7 (which converts to an
11 by her +4 DM), indicating success.  She rolls an 12 for her time roll, which
would normally mean a time of six minutes.  But because of the hasty task
attempt, she subtracts twice her DM's from the roll, for a total of 4, meaning
it takes her two minutes to get her scout off the ground.  Thirty seconds later,
the Ooga-Boogas rush into the clearing where she had been parked, only to find
her mysteriously gone.  Such are the ways of the gods...

Notice that in the above example, it took about as long to get the scout ship
off the ground as it does to scramble a typical fighter plane.  However, in her
rush to get off the ground to avoid a code break, Sue forgot her safety checks,
making her task attempt uncertain.  Unless the referee also rolls a 7 or better,
Sue might just find herself stranded on this TL 0 planet... such are the risks
you take in lifting in a big hurry.

- -- Palmer Davis --
[email removed]

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#619 RE: Re: cold start launch

[This came to [email removed], looks like it was meant for
[email removed].  Watch those automatic reply headers! -- James]

RE: F-20s

      Northrop has, in fact,demonstrated the ability of an F-20 to be
airbourne at 20,000 feet some absurdly small time after the pilot has
been strapped into the cockpit.  What has NOT been revealed is how
long the crew chief has had to beat on the plane beforehand.
      In striking contrast, the most optomistic time NASA eve{ quoted
for turning around a shuttle was something like a month.
     A few minutes to do a fast launch, a few weeks.  Both times are
utterly reasonable.  Take your pick.

Paul Gazis

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#622 RE: Re: cold start launch

>>

Looking at this another way... when an US Navy ship prepares to get underway
from "Cold Iron" this can take a couple of days.  When it tries the same stunt
from some sort of "warm start" it can just be a few hours.

Pete


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All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Submissions: [email removed], or [email removed]
Administrator: [email removed] (James Perkins)
The TML is made possible by facilities provided by Tektronix, Inc.