What I want from TML

A thread of 4 messages, 28 March 1994 to 31 March 1994, in the order they were sent.

#7087 What I want from TML

One quick comment, one quick question

(question perhaps that should be on Computer Aided Traveller...)

The Comment;

I agree with Rodger Sanger that the TML is a list I signed onto primarily
as a source of material.  I also would encourage (enthusiastically) the
other activities (something I think Rodger feels as well) as having their
own value and a place on this list.

To that end, have any of our talented programmers written starship design or
vehicle design programs?  Probably some are still in the making...

I am using Microsoft Excel and have (in about 6 hours of work) made a
reasonably presentable small arms design template (conventional only)
and will post at least the test design in the next few days.

If anyone wants a copy of the Excel Spreadsheet Template (in Excel 3.0/windows)
just drop me a line.  The spreadsheet requires having FF&S to fill in some
places, but does all of the formulae.

The Question;

Has anyone tried to use one of these home floorplan design programs to do
deckplans?  I am considering laying out the $40-60 on such a product for just
such a purpose and would like a reccomendation.

Is it possible that we could come to some internal (to the TML) informal
standard which would allow al of us to exchange deck plans?  I have several
(all of the hand-drawn variety) which I am rather happy about, but have not
been able to find a suitable medium for putting them in a computer.

The one program I have used is the inexpensive CAD program from IMSL (name
escapes me "something-cad").  Perhaps I am not suited to the controls, but
I could not easily reproduce accurately my starship design (in a reasonable
amount of time).

Happy travelling,

Pete

"The opinions expressed certainly have nothing whatever to do with
the University of Chicago or the Department of Biochemistry (I just
work there and use their toys)."

Peter Brenton					   [phone removed]
Biochemistry & Molecular Biology	[email removed]
The University of Chicago

#7088 Ship design & deckplans

Peter H. Brenton [email removed] writes:
> To that end, have any of our talented programmers written starship design
> or vehicle design programs? Probably some are still in the making...

Paul Dale (I think) wrote one LONG AGO for MegaTraveller, the CAT list
took a good look at it then.

> I am using Microsoft Excel and have (in about 6 hours of work) made a
> reasonably presentable small arms design template (conventional only) and
> will post at least the test design in the next few days.

DOn't just post, upload it to ftp.engrg.uwo.ca.  If you cannot, get
after me to do it for you.

> Has anyone tried to use one of these home floorplan design programs to do
> deckplans? I am considering laying out the $40-60 on such a product for
> just such a purpose and would like a reccomendation.

Mark Cook has used a drawing program and come up with some of the best
deck plans I've ever seen. Check out the Elissa, Alcyon, and other deck
plans on ftp.engrg.uwo.ca, under the pbem directory. Also there are a
few more in the vehicles directory.

> Is it possible that we could come to some internal (to the TML)
> informal standard which would allow al of us to exchange deck plans? I
> have several (all of the hand-drawn variety) which I am rather happy
> about, but have not been able to find a suitable medium for putting
> them in a computer.

The best image format, that the greatest number of people can view and
manipulate, remains GIF.  A far second is, perhaps, MS-Windows BMP.

Standing on the shoulders of other TMLers who did the work,

James

__   __/         /   /	    Internet Traveller Mailing List, Administrator
    /     /  /  /   /	   James T. Perkins in Eugene, Oregon, USA
 __/   __/__/__/ _____/   [email removed]

#7091 Re: TML nightly: Msgs 7081-7090 V70#20

James T Perkins [email removed] writes:
> Peter H. Brenton [email removed] writes:
[stuff deleted}
> > I am using Microsoft Excel and have (in about 6 hours of work) made a
> > reasonably presentable small arms design template (conventional only) and
> > will post at least the test design in the next few days.
>
> DOn't just post, upload it to ftp.engrg.uwo.ca.  If you cannot, get
> after me to do it for you.

Anyone out there using Quattro Pro for Windows?  if so I have a
finished small arms design worksheet that includes CPR slug throwers,
gauss small arms and grenade launchers.  *Most* of the noticable bugs
are fixed but NO gurentees.  I beleive Excel can translate it into
smoething it can understand, if not I can try to port it over.  (This
is starting to sound like a practical problem for you language folks
out there :)) E-mail me privately ifinterested and I'd upload it to
ftp.engrg.uwo.ca if there sufficient interest.

> > Has anyone tried to use one of these home floorplan design programs to do
> > deckplans? I am considering laying out the $40-60 on such aproduct for
> > just such a purpose and would like a reccomendation.

used one over chrismas...can't remember the name...but I didn't run
down the street jumping for joy. :(

> Mark Cook has used a drawing program and cme up with some of the best
> deck plans I've ever seen. Check out the Elissa, Alcyon, and other deck
> plans on ftp.engrg.uwo.ca, under the pbem directory. Also there are a
> few more in the vehicles directory.
>
> > Isit possible that we could come to some internal (to the TML)
> > informal standard which would allow al of us to exchange deck plans? I
> > have several (all of the hand-drawn variety) which I am rather happy
> > about, bu have not been able to find a suitable medium for putting
> > them in a computer.
>
> The best image format, that the greatest number of people can view and
> manipulate, remains GIF.  A far second is, perhaps, MS-Windows MP.
If so perhaps we should make available some shareware Gif/BMP viewers
at ftp.engrg.uwo.ca.  BTW how would one go about editing GIF images?

Adios!

- -Ed F.

#7125 Designing Deckplans...

In TML Msg. Num. 7091 Caffine Achiever! (Ed F.) [email removed] writes:

> James T Perkins [email removed] writes:
>
> > Mark Cook has used a drawing program and came up with some of the best
> > deck plans I've ever seen. Check out the Elissa, Alcyon, and other deck
> > plans on ftp.engrg.uwo.ca, under the pbem directory. Also there are a
> > few more in the vehicles directory.

That drawing program is xgedit, a proprietary X11-based raster editor
that I developed for in-house graphics design, which working for
Hewlett-Packard.  It's not an HP product, and I retain the source
code rights, but since it was developed on HP time, I can't release
source without legal authorization from HP.  I *can* however, distribute
executables, assuming that I've got a UNIX platform available to compile
on.  Currently, I can make binaries avaible for HP and Sun workstations.
Sorry, but it's not portable to PC/DOS/Windows environments.  The editor
can read and write XBM, XWD, TIFF (1 & 4 channel), and raw Eroff files.
It can't read or write GIF, but I use Jef Poskanzer's PBMPlus utilities
to convert to and from GIF, so it's not much of an obstacle.

BTW, xgedit is a pure raster editor and does not come with any "pre-
constructed" components, like most architectural design software.
Thus, if you want to design starship deckplans, you have to draw
everything from scratch.  This is not as hard as it sounds, as you
can design 1 acceleration couch a pixel at a time in the zoom editor,
and then replicate it (rotated as necessary) anywhare on the ship.
I found that only the first ship was hard to design (as I was creating
all the components for the first time.)  After that, I just cut-n-pasted
a lot of stuff from the first ship to subsequent designs.

> > > Is it possible that we could come to some internal (to the TML)
> > > informal standard which would allow al of us to exchange deck plans? I
> > > have several (all of the hand-drawn variety) which I am rather happy
> > > about, bu have not been able to find a suitable medium for putting
> > > them in a computer.
> >
> > The best image format, that the greatest number of people can view and
> > manipulate, remains GIF.  A far second is, perhaps, MS-Windows MP.

I've conducted TML surveys on two seperate occasions.  The most
favored image format is GIF by a long stretch, following (I *think*)
by EPS raster.  I'm not sure about the second format, as I'm typing
this from work and my notes are on my (unreachable from here) workstation
at home. :^(

> If so perhaps we should make available some shareware Gif/BMP viewers
> at ftp.engrg.uwo.ca.  BTW how would one go about editing GIF images?

If you want a standard GIF viewer for UNIX/X11 environments, your
best choice is XV.  The source is available by anon. ftp from
export.lcs.mit.edu (look in ~/pub/contrib.)  I'm not sure about
PC platforms.  The PBMPlus utility source is also available in
that location.

Later,

mark f. cook * 2055 sw whiteside dr. * corvallis, or * [email removed]
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"When your enemy falls, don't rejoice -- but don't pick him up either."
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