[email removed] (Phil Pugilese) writes:
> My major gripe is that there will be, in all likelihood, no
> more supplements, & probably no material at all, that will be
> usable by me. For me this is a *MAJOR* loss & one that I will
> be incapable of replacing.
>
> I think this reason alone is ample cause to bitch. The fact that
> bitching is about all I *can* do just makes it all the more ir-
> ritating.
The only other thing you can do is "vote with your wallet". If you don't
expect to be able to use any T:TNE suppliments, Challenge articles, and whatnot
in your game, by all means *don't* buy T:TNE, Brilliant Lances, or any other
GDW Traveller products. If there are enough people out there who agree with
you, then GDW *will* get the message, albeit the hard way.
Mark Urbin [email removed] writes:
> I was cleaning up my hard disk and found this gem from when I received the
> `skunk-works' mailing list. It reminded me of the thread a month or so ago
> about using the fusion powered rockets as weapons.
"skunk-works" mailing list?! *THAT* sounds interesting!
As far as "Project Pluto" is concerned, the message accurately describes
a missile known as "Project Pluton" and the subject of an article in
an old issue of Air&Space/Smithsonian (back issues are $3.50 from:
Air&Space/Smithsonian Back Issues, 370 L'Enfant Promenade SW, 10th floor,
[address removed]
believe that it was April/May 1992, but I may be mistaken. A picture of
the missile is on the cover.
> Nuclear ramjet efficiencies increase with temperature, so Pluto's ramjet
> was designed to operate at 2500 degrees Fahrenheit.
As I recall, the reactor was designed to operate within a few degrees (less
than 20) of its failure temperature.
> Project cancelled on July 1, 1964. ICBMS were cheaper and faster.
One of the other problems cited in the project's cancellation was the
the difficulty of flight-testing the beast. One proposal was to tether
the missile with a long cable to an island in the Pacific. If the autopilot
or flight controls failed, the missile would circle the island until
it crashed, its fuel was exhausted (which could take days), or it was
destroyed.
[email removed] (Brian Makens) writes:
> Previously, the Zho's could justify the dictatorship
> of the psionic by saying that ZHO society is
> significantly more progressive than the Imp's with
> it crude repression of psionic talent, and that
> psionic nobles having all the say, thought police
> and re-education are just some of the cost of the
> better society.
I don't think most Zhodani, even the nobles, think that way. Remember that
Zhodani society is designed to produce members that believe that Zhodani
society is the best possible for Humans to live under.
While most Imperial citizens believe that the "Thought Police" are a form of
secret police who spy on everyone's thoughts, and that the "Re-Education
Centers" as sopisticated and effective brainwashing, Zhodani don't see it
that way at all. The average Zhodani Prole or Intendant (and many nobles as
well) see the "Thought Police" in a way analogous to the way most Americans
feel about Mike Flanagan, the cop who walks the local beat. Except that
the Zhodani version are always there when (or actually, before) you need
them. To most Zhodani citizens, the "Re-Education Centers" are more like
mental hospitals, except that the doctors can see what's going on in a
patient's mind, and fix it, just as easily as a physician can set a bone
using X-rays as a guide. Any prole or intendant who more than slightly
disagrees with this world view is picked up by the "Thought Police" sooner
or later, and sent to a "Re-Education Center" until they really and truly
believe it. Most Zhodani are products of their educational system, which
is very effective in instilling the beliefs and habits expected of proper
Zhodani. With the few, unstable exceptions, the average Zhodani is as
unlikely to question their society as the average American is to go berzerk,
grab a gun, and start shooting people at random. It happens; one in
several hundreds of millions each year.
Nobles, particularly those with strong psionic talents, are allowed more
freedom to dissent without being censured or re-educated; but even so, most
of them are products of the Zhodani educational system, which in almost all
cases instills these beliefs in childhood. Nobles are probably more aware
of the cost of this system: Zhodani social institutions are relatively
rigid, and do have a tendancy to stifle the creativity to some degree.
Some nobles may go so far as to establish enclaves where un-Re-Educated
researchers can explore, investigate, and create without being Re-Educated
whenever they go too far off the deep end. Of course, other nobles may
feel that this is being cruel to the people involved (who would certainly
be unhappy about being kept in a padded cell, no matter how well
furnished). As a matter of fact, this whole subject might be best
explored in an adventure setting ...
> Now Deneb has a society with open psionic members,
> and the proles there just don't seemed to get shoved
> the Regency around the same as back on Zhodane.
Zhodani citizens are likeley to (still) look upon citizens of the Regency
with some combination of fear, pity, and distrust. After all, those poor
people still have to deal with the Regency court system, which is at worst
a tool of opression, and at best relies on the memory and judgement of the
participants. Compare to the Zhodani system, where a noble can examine
the accused psionically and determine guilt or innocence directly. And
while the various police and security forces of the Regency may try their
best, they are still not as good at preventing crime before it happens as
the Zhodani "Thought Police" - most Regency criminal investigations start
*after* the crime has been committed; a small consolation if you happen
to be the victim.
The Zhodani consulate is still the only place in which houses, starships, and
personal valuables can be left unlocked and unguarded without fear of
theft or vandalism. And most Zhodani probably still fear the dishonesty
and violence of Regency society.
> This is assuming of course that Norris didn't decide that
> the Tlacaverde(sp?..its been awhile, what can I
> say my zhodani is rusty)thought police is a neat idea,
> and got some of his own. But that would mean the
> Spinward marches, ain't the old Spinward
> Marches we know and love.
There is some evidence that Norris in particular, and Imperial Naval
Intelligence in general, has always had psionic special operatives. This
goes well back into Classic Traveller; check out the relevant entries
in the Classic Traveller library data suppliments. If they exist, they
will probably be very, very secret, even into the "present" of the New Era.
> See GDW, I can have a positive discussion of
> the TNE universe, without foaming at the mouth.
> Now pleeze untie this strait jacket..
> Now give me back my butcher knife......<grin>
> TNE author-> Strength 0 Endurance 0...
> Bad Boy..Bad Boy..Quick ...Sedate Him Nurse
No, no, no. Straightjackets aren't the way to go. I'll just
turn you over to Daviv Nilsenptrl of the Thought Police, and
he can ship you off to a Re-Education Center to be kindly
and patiently Re-Educated until your thoughts fall within the
accepted norms. You will no longer be troubled with non-conformist,
illegal thought patterms... ;-)
[email removed] (J. Robertson) writes:
> What is everyone's problem with Megatraveller? I never actually ran a campaign,
> It was the first serious role-playing
> game where I could keep all my character's vital stats on an indez card. The
> only difficulty I encountered was space combat/encounters,
I assume that you never experienced Classic Traveller (either in the form of the
little black books, or The Traveller Book). Many of the features you (and most
others) liked were in Classic Traveller as well. The thing you complained of
(difficulty in resolving space encounters) worked rather well, if a little
simplistically, in Classic Traveller.
MegaTraveller did several things right. The task system was an excellent
extension to Classic Traveller, and finally all of the character generation was
put into one book.
I had one major gripe with MegaTraveller: Errors. Far too many of them. There
were also a number of minor problems: MegaTraveller was expensive, and it was
organized so that game rules and background were spread out through the three
books, so that you *had* to get all three (at a rather expensive price) to
have a playable game. The design sequences were complex, and riddled with
errors (designing a starship took an enjoyable less than fifteen minutes with
pencil and paper and Classic Traveller's Book 2 or Book 5; MegaTraveller took
several hours and required a calculator or computer spreadsheet). One of
MegaTraveller's biggest problems was one of attracting new players: in my
experience, MegaTraveller was hard for new players to understand and "get into".
Not because of the extensive background information, but due to the way it
was presented. MegaTraveller was written by people who were intimately
familliar with *ALL* of it, and many parts of the result assumed that the
reader was similarly knowledgable. In other words, it made sense to Traveller
players and baffled outsiders. Play testing and/or soliciting opinions on
MegaTraveller from people who weren't previously familliar with Traveller
would have caught and fixed this problem.
> BTW, for vehicle design of ANY type: GURPS Vehicles. Any tech level, magical
> engines or capabilities. . . the examples cover everything from chariots to
> cars to Jets to Vectored Trust vehicles. . .no starships, though. . .But you
> can build them.
Aren't starships and spaceships covered in GURPS Space?
For weapon design, of ANY type: Greg Porter's _Guns, Guns, Guns_ 3rd Edition
(3G3 to it's friends). 3G3 has conversion to Twilight: 2000 (2nd Ed) in the
back of the book (this will, of course, convert to Traveller: The New Era as
well, because it uses the T2k2 system). Conversion to MegaTraveller and other
system are covered, as well. Greg has done his homework, and has had two
previous editions to work the bugs out of the rules. 3G3 works *very* well,
and is relatively easy to use and understand. 3G3 will be one of my standards
for comparison to FF&S when it finally comes out.
James Kundert [email removed] writes:
> What sort of settings are you using? What is the feel of your
> campaign? The TNE setting includes everything the Third Imperium
> did except for "decadent imperial nobility" and "all-out war".
My last campaign was set in the Spinward Marches, and involved a noble
son who enlisted in the Scout Service against his father's wishes and
his cousin from the "wrong side of the tracks". This campaign, amount
other things, featured characters that were absolutely unwilling to
break (or even bend) any Imperial law, and managed to never break any
local laws either. This campaign featured a lot of role-playing and
very little combat at all.
In other campaigns, I have had a player character who refused to carry
a firearm. I have had charecters that, during the entire campaign, haven't
used deadly force against anybody. I have also had campaigns that
involved a mercenary unit, and routinely featured some sort of combat.
Most campaigns have fallen somewhere inbetween these two extremes.
This isn't to say that my campaigns aren't interesting or exciting, but
I choose to add excitement to the adventure in many different ways. This
isn't really a good time to go into the basics of plotting, but suffice
it to say that there are many ways of adding suspense, conflict, and
excitement into an adventure plotline without resorting to armed violence.
I feel that combat is empahsized in too many role-playing game scenarios.
Combat is easy to write in, and it provides a garanteed "cheap thrill".
But think back; many of your most memorable moments in an RPG, or for
that matter, in a movie or television show, aren't the combats. As
human beings, it is the interaction of people that holds our interest.
So, make it a people story. Watch good television or movies, and see
those writers use their tricks: because this is a science-fiction game
we're talking about, Star Trek: The Next Generation and Deep Space Nine
are always good sources of insparation. But also old dramatic series
like Hill Street Blues and St. Elsewhere work as well. While you're
enjoying your favorite show, also think about how it was plotted: what
is the writer up to, what makes this a good (or bad) show.
> Continue to gripe if you must, but at least gripe in a specific
> fashion. If you see a regrettable gap in the coverage, mention it
> to the right people. There are enough writers within shouting distance
> of this list that SOMEONE may get inspired to fill the gap, even if
> you cannot.
Material presented in Challenge seems to me to have limited play value.
Most of the published material are short adventures, and they typically
depend on definite and specific "starting conditions" that makes them
hard to integrate into a non-official campaign.
Material that I have found useful in _The Journal_ includes non-adventure
pieces on role-playing and plotting in general, and relatively independent
adventure ideas that can be placed in many campaigns.
Some of the best sources of these "adventure ideas" were the old Casual
Encounter and Amber Zone columns. The best of these (including "Finger"
and "Geria Transfer") are relatively world and background independent, and
can be dropped into an ongoing campaign to side track the PCs for a while.
james vassilakos [email removed] writes:
> Is this stuff available on sunbane in a semi-useable format?
> Yes... you guessed it... you've just been targeted for assimilation,
> so don't even think about resisting. :-)
Resistance is USELESS!
Everything we've done is available in raw form (meaning that you will
have to sift through the message archives to extract the stuff) from
the archive site at ocf.berkeley.edu, in the pub/Traveller/TNE-pocket
directory. We are working on getting the draft materials together in
one place right now, it will probably take a while.
[email removed] writes:
> High-tech weaponry has to be more effective than low tech, if only to justify
> the (almost invariably) massive cost increases. I already have variant stats
> worked out, but this produces the problem of diverging from the official rules,
> which makes new GDW products less useful, as others have already commented on.
Actually variant weapons stats, or even variant combat rules, isn't so much
of a problem. As long as your variant system has a comprehensive set of
weapons and handles all of the situations that the "standard" does, what's
the problem?
Back in the days of Classic Traveller, there were lots of variant combat
systems running around. Some people used the original, while lots of folks
used Snapshot, Azhanti High Lightning, or Striker, and some people did
unusual variants on those.
If anybody does work out variant weapons stats, I certainly hope that
they will post them here for the rest of us to use.
Matthew Goldman [email removed] writes:
> Suggestion with 1/2 :-): Offer a complete set of Classic Traveller
> books on CD rom. Take prepayments with the condition that the CD will
> be printed if and only if a certain number of orders come in. A week
> or two with an OCR scanner an you'd be all set. You could even break
> it down into a number of CDs, Combined Rules, Adventures, Supplements,
> Journals, etc.
The company I work for publishes (on an approximately annual basis) a
CD-ROM containing a rather specialized database and associated retrieval
software. For the last few years, we have used Sony as our supplier;
we provide the data (some 200Mb) to Sony in DOS format, and they convert
it to ISO standard format, and press the disks. The cost for 150 disks
is between $1200 and $1700, depending on what sort of deal we can swing
with them. Most of this cost is a fixed set-up charge and a fixed data
conversion charge (usually $500 to convert to ISO format), the per-disk
costs are low, about $1 to $2 per disk. This is for disks individually
shrink-wrapped in jewel boxes, and two-color artwork printed on the
disk, but no liner in the box (just shows the disk through the clear top).
Everything published to date for Traveller (let's say *EVERYTHING*: all
of Classic Traveller, all the adventures, all the suppliments, every
issue of the Journal of the Travellers' Aid society, all of MegaTraveller
and everything published for it. Furthermore, let's be optimistic
and assume that you can negotiate for all of the third-party stuff:
all of the Paranoia Press, FASA, and DGP stuff for Traveller and
MegaTraveller, and all the rest). It would probably *ALL* fit on a
single CD-ROM. It would be a large piece of work organizing it, but
with the help of a scanner and some dedication, it is a doable
task.
Let's assume the following arrangement: Let's say you convince GDW to
allow this for (say) $2 per disk plus 30% of the net (after everything
has been paid for) profit, if any. If you wanted to include any of the
DGP stuff (and it might be nice), maybe they'd go for $1 plus 10%, and
ditto for FASA, and maybe up to $1 per disk plus none of the net profits
for other Traveller liscencees (like Paranoia Press, Gamelords, etc, if
the copyright holders can be located). Give yourself $0 per disk plus
50% of the net profit, which makes a total of $5 per disk in royalties.
OK, then let's set the "list price" of the disk at $50 per disk; then
let's allow $5 per disk for overhead (hopefully less than this), leaving
$40 per disk. Furthermore, let's give the pre-orders a 10% ($5) price
break.
Therefore you would need about 45 pre-orders in hand to break even. If
you get more pre-orders than that, you might want to order a number of
disks that totals about three times the number of pre-orders recieved.
Presumably you would wait until you had at least 45 pre-orders before you
went and had the disks pressed. In such a case, you would be out
your time (but not your money), while GDW would get $90, if all you
sold were those 45 pre-orders.
If you eventually sold all 150 of the disks, let's assume 100 of them
direct (50 at $45 and 50 at $50 each), and the other 50 through stores
(the stores pay you $25 each, and sell them for the $50 list price), the
final results would be: $6000 gross. Pressing cost $1500. Royalties
cost $750, and overhead $750, leaving a net profit of $3000. You would
make a total of $1500. GDW would get ($300+$900) $1200, DGP and FASA
would get $450 each, while the others would get some fraction of $150.
Worth it? You decide.
"Anthony K. Baggaley" [email removed] writes:
> Ah, we can but dream (at the moment). I love the idea, but wouldn't the
> whole of GDWs, FASAs and DGPs published material fit on one CD ROM, especial-
> ly if illos were cut back? You could probably fit HIWGs stuff as well, I've
> got a lot of it and it doesn't take up much room on the hard drive (since
> it's all ASCII).
I'm certain that all of the text for all of the published Traveller material
to date would easily fit on a single CD-ROM. The only question is how many
maps, illustrations, and other graphic materials could you include.
Robert S. Dean [email removed] writes:
> Sigh. Too true. So, what _is_ selling well these days? Also, is there
> any chance that you could recap the history behind the Classic->MT shift
> sometime? I'm sure a lot of us would be interested.
Add my name to the "interested" list.
> Just as a matter of idle curiosity, what sort of terms would you license use
> of the Traveller tm under now? Suppose, for purposes of this example, that
> I wanted to publish a collection of mini-adventures in a close approximation
> of the old format (64 page, digest sized, etc.)...
Inquiring minds want to know. Does GDW have any "standard" for liscencing
(come to think of it, does GDW have any current liscencees?), and are there
any plans afoot to bring liscencees aboard?
One of the things that was good about Classic Traveller's heyday was the
number and variety of things that were available. The ones I remember from
early on where Paranoia Press and FASA. Having a variety of different
companies publishing made for nice variety. Is there anybody besides
Scott Kellogg and myself who remember the FASA "Sky Raiders" series with
great fondness?
[email removed] writes (Vanya):
> 1) Combat is very safe (avg damage from 9mm round-3.5pts, avd hits avg
> character can take in chest (STR+CON)*3=(6+6)*3=36pts --> 10 rounds of 9mm):
> the average party will run out of ammo before they are killed. (I calmly let
> him shoot me in the gut while I return fire.)
I defer to someone who is more familiar with the T2k2 system to figure
this part out. I *assume* Vanya's calculations are correct, but he could
be missing a factor somewhere. It does jive with what little I know about
the T2k2 system: it simulates combat as shown on movies and television
rather than real life. Lots of gunplay to add "excitement" to the
adventure, but not too deadly or we'll kill the PCs off.
Quick-n-Dirty fixes: (Don't know what this does to "game balance" or anything
else, but it definitely *WILL* make combat deadlier). Double the damage value
of all slug throwers TL-8 and below. Triple the damage value of slug
throwers TL-9 and above. Change the penetration values of laser weapons to
1/4 (one quarter), leave damage alone. In personal combat consider high-energy
(plasma and fusion) weapon hits agains personnel who are not in "hard" armor
(hard armor means Combat Armor or Battle Dress) as 100% fatal; resolve high
energy fire agains Combat Armor or Battle Dress normally). This *hasn't*
been tested, but give it a try and let us know what you find out.
> [about adventure lines precluded]
If you like the T:TNE rules set, go ahead and play in the "Classic" Imperium;
don't worry, the GDW Thought Police won't come and take your campaign away
from you.
> Indeed. The Imperium is no more. Our beloves Third Imperium is gone, replaced
> with many small, bickering factions. There was no reaseon to trash the sectors
> we know and love. The rebellion was bad enough, but it worked in a gaming
> sence. The Virus just doesnt cut it.
Hey, whoa. If you (like I do) have a lot of the old background data, go ahead
and use it. In my opinion, it *IS* one of Traveller's greatest resources.
Something which I would have preferred to see in T:TNE was a separation between
the rules set and the "Official" background universe. This was the case in
the original Traveller game: about all the background it contained was the
"Travellers' Aid Society", and the assumption that game play would take place
in an established interstellar society.
Although earlier products (in particular, the Traveller Book) led the way in
including background material and "starter" adventures in the rules, it was
MegaTraveller that really broke away from the original concept.
I was hoping that T:TNE would start back in the other direction, but alas
this is not so. I'm afraid that this might make it a little more difficult
to put out "universe" books, that detail alternate campaign universes
using the T:TNE rules. One such universe might be Classic Traveller, in
which the Rebellion and Virus never happened. Others might be 2300AD, and
even completely new (or liscenced from some S-F writer) ones.
> Oh, PS: To those who say 'Dont complain unless you got a fix', I got a fix. I
> can complain because I love Traveller and hate to see it go down the fresher,
> even if the guys tinkling on it is GDW. (Party Line, whats that?)
I think I've said that in the past, as have others. You have a fix; you do
indeed get to say what you think is wrong, and how your solution addresses
those problems. It's the details that are hard sledding; but keep us posted,
perhaps members of the TML can help out or just lend an ear.
[email removed]
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Science-Fiction Adventure
In the Far Future