Re: "Conventional" missiles for T:TNE

> Bertil Jonell [email removed] writes:
> > [assumptions about missiles]
>
> These seem reasonable.
>
> >   I think we should divide it into four types instead of three.
>
> That sounds good, too.  But I'm going to argue that Cannister missiles
> should be in category three (short-range shrapnel missiles).

  Perhaps category 2 should be modified from slow shrapnel on long ranges
to slow shrapnel on medium ranges.

  I looked on how much an evading ship could burn since the detonation, and
moving 400m at 6G takes a little more than 3s. At closing velocity 1, the
shrapnel moves 48km in 3s, and 48km is significantly more than the 'a few km'
that is the range of nuke and SFF missiles (big enough difference to warrant
category 2 IMHO).
  (Back to the charge idea: The spheres has to spread with 130m/s radial to
get to 400m in 3s.)

  The reason for my perservance is that I think there is need for a cheap
non-nuke missile that works with a penalty of one difficulty level and lower
damage and penetration. It fills a niche.

> The levels
> of difficulty seem about right, too.  One more thing: in category four,
> we should probably add "smart rocks": an "impact only" missile with no
> warhead; damage by kinetic energy of impact.

  Yes, but like I said, I don't want to think about the impact energy of this
one.

> I'm partial to inertial with terminal active radar homing (and of
> course, the bearing only launch option).  The USN Harpoon is a good
> example of what I mean.

  Guess we look on them from different viewpoints: I look on them as SAM's or
AAM's and you use the SSM model:)

> That sounds reasonable; and the same rules can apply to any type of FIM
> missile that has a command reciever as well.  One more thing I can think
> of, though.  T:TNE assumes a tightbeam command link (laser); if the
> missile ever goes fully independent (the command limk is cut off for
> whatever reason), you can't re-acquire the missile --- it stays in FIM
> mode because you no longer have accurate pointing data your laser.

  Depends on how tightbeam that laser is, and on if the firing vessel has
a sensor lock on the missile itself.

>>   So I persist that the 'detonation' range of the cannister round can be the
>> same as for the xray missile:)
>
> I persist in insisting that it's practically impossible.

  Ok, I've gone down to 50km:)

> No; fire the bursting charge based on estimated time to impact, so that
> the fragments always have the same amount of time to disperse.

  Yup, that's easier.

>>   Perhaps too severe for game balance. The effect of one 10mm tungsten sphere
>> at 16km/second (closure velocity of 1) is 2-30 if I write it in the same
>> form as the laser damage. Imagine a 7 ton missile...
>
> But hitting the target is pretty hard, as we have both pointed out.

  I have an nasty suspicion that a kinetic only missile would be more
effective than a HE missile... I don't have my books here, but I think the
energy even at closing velocity 1 would be in the nuclear range (0.1 to 10kt).

> A couple of other points which have occurred to me: the missiles use a
> laser link for communications to the firing ship.  A cannister of
> anti-laser "sand" placed at just the right spot should do wonders to
> break this link;

  But think about the trouble to predict where that spot will be. Both the
launcher, the missile and the target jets around at high speed and the TNE
sand casters don't work in the 'eject a large unguided cloud of sand' mode
of classic Traveller.

> Managing to intercept the target and go for a proximity or impact hit
> should be considerably easier if you are quite close to the target.
> Like in the same range band with it.  Does T:TNE already have a modifier
> for this? (if not, there probably should be one for <1 range band and >5
> range bands for proximity and impact missiles).

  I wonder if it is necessary. A simple trader firing a impact only missile
on a Small target within the same range band will have a Formidable task
(Average to begin with, +3 to Impossible for the missile, -1 for the size of
 the target) which usually is a hit 25% of the time. That is good for a
target that potentially can be 30,000km away.

  Ok, perhaps. But not more than -1 difficulty.

  My idea was that the 'simple terminal guidance' I talk about removes the
need for an extra mod for >5 range bands above and beyond the usual -1
per 3 range bands.

> >   I'll post a message with tenative designs for HE, HEAT, Cannister, SFF and
> > LGB missiles as soon as I've typed them in.
>
> Aside from the gotcha with cannister, I've seen these and like them.

  Thanks.

  BTW: Does anyone have other ideas for missiles? I have thought about a
nuke pumped 'fusion gun' warhead analogous to the laser warhead but fail to
see how it would differ to any significant degree.
  Cluster warheads are also a possibility but the anti-ship effect of those
would be inferior to cannister IMHO.

> [email removed]

- -bertil-
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