TML: A House Divided?

Gentlesophonts:

Okay, you may remember when James initially posted the suggestion of
creating another mailing list for the anti-TNE crowd that I jumped at
the idea.  Since then I've had some second thoughts.

I'm going to get to Mark Cook's arguments for the separate list in a moment.
(Nothing personal Mark, you're just a handy proponent.)  First though, I'd
like to explain my own situation.  I'm pretty new to TML - only having
subscribed in January of this year.  I think since then though, I've been
a pretty active contributor - for good or ill!  :-)  I started the CT/MT
vs. TNE background discussion a while back and I think most of you ought
to know that I have little use for TNE.  I don't give a hoot about rules
(I never even used the CT/MT rules for much of anything except character
and world generation) and I feel the TNE background offers *nothing* over
what could have been done with a CT/MT `frontier sourcebook'.  While I
have just about *every* GDW and DGP product since those first `Three Little
Black Books', I have not purchased *any* TNE products and I'm seriously
considering letting my subscription to *Challenge*, which goes back to
*JTAS* #5, expire.

That said, Mark Cook [email removed] writes:

> Join both groups.  If the hassle is too much, maybe your enthusiasm isn't
> enough.

One might suggest the same about `oldtimers' who find it too much hassle to
put up with the `noise' of TNE postings.

> That's not really the point.  We (the anti-TNE folks) want to not have to
> wade through the low signal-to-noise ratio that TNE presents in the TML.

I'm not sure I buy this.  If all these folks were still contributing there
wouldn't be such a `low signal-to-noise' ratio.

> It a separate group, it ceases to be a problem for us, and those of you
> that enjoy TNE (and creamed spinich and enemas and so on...) can stay
> right here and do exactly what you've been doing all along.
>
> > Seems like a rather lopsided issue to me.
>
> Seems like a pretty selfish one to me.  You'd rather keep us around, even
> when we don't want to be here, rather than lose part of your audience?

Hmmm.  There seems to be plenty `selfishness' to go around here.  Look,
I'm just as pissed as anyone at what GDW has done to Traveller and I don't
appreciate these `newbies' bitching about my `whining' all the time either
but that doesn't mean I want to pick up my toys and go play by myself.

> This may cause many folks that dropped out to come back.  The flip side
> is many are leaving anyway, they just don't have anywhere else to go.
> The separate mailing list would resolve that.

I doubt it, but I'd like to offer a challenge to allow you to prove me wrong.
Let's have all these hordes of oldtimers `walk their walk' instead of just
`talk their talk'.  Let's see what this new mailing list would look like
right her in TML.  Beginning June 1st (which should give enough time to
get the word out and to let folks transitioning from school to get settled
for the summer) let's have `Pre-TNE Days on TML' for all these oldtimers
who are just bursting with megabytes of pre-PIE-in-the-sky information to
contribute.

I would *love* the opportunity to participate in discussions about Imperial
background.  That's what I loved about HIWG (except I wasn't `on-line'
with GENIE which kept me somewhat `ghettoized').  I would *love* to develop
*other* campaign backgrounds like the Earth Colonies on TNE.  If folks were
really contributing like this I suspect all the TNE devotees would be
`dropping out' or clamoring for their `own' list.  (Sorry, newbies.)

But I don't think that will happen.  I suspect those folks who are dropping
out have a variety of other reasons besides merely the TNE `signal-to-
noise' ratio - things like other priorities in their lives now, something
that happens to all of us.  But please, go ahead and prove me wrong beginning
June 1st.

I also think there is another problem with creating a new list.  Namely, if we
start with the anti-TNE crowd, where do we stop?  I (and many others I
suspect) was never very pleased with MegaTraveller and the Rebellion.  Do
we get a pre-MT/Rebellion list next?  How about a `background only' list
so I don't have to be hassled by all those pesky, boring discussions about
laser comm frequencies and starship lavatory design?  What about an anti-
Grandfather list for those of us who disliked that whole fantasy trip?
And another list where the Sword Worlds don't have those d**ned economic
cycles of Hans's?  :-)

Now, please, Mark (and others), let's not have more argument about our
arguments about a new list.  Just take me up on my challenge and start
posting all that pre-TNE stuff to the TML.  You don't even have to wait
until June 1st - get that `signal-to-noise' ratio up *now* because every bit
of bandwidth that's wasted arguing against me instead of being pre-TNE
posts just makes my case and argues against a separate list.

". . . [A] house divided against itself, cannot stand."

                               -Abraham Lincoln

Peace,

David Johnson
Houston, Texas, USA